Setting / locking walls to a specific length

[Paul The Aussie]

Hi everyone. VERY new to TFP V15 but I've been using it heavily for 3 days and I still can't figure out how to set / lock the length of walls. I'm trying to setup about 30 pre-existing house plans and i do use the box down the bottom to enter the exact length of each wall, but i find that by time i'v got about about halfway through building around the exterior walls that they have all adjusted themselves to fit whatever they think they're trying to fit.

I guess I don't want the software to be so smart and just accept and stick with the measurements I enter.

I am actually going insane and haven't even got through my first plan yet.

Please, please help.

Kind regards

[Allan Chesney]

Hi Paul,  Welcome to the Forum and great to have another Aussie on board!!! (Where do you live?)

Well, I have been using TurboFLOORPLAN  and its predecessor Floorplan3D for about 10 years or more (since V3) and I have never yet keyed in a wall length!!.  

All I do is draw the walls roughly to the exterior shape (5-10 seconds), and I keep a bit of an eye on the dimensions as they read out as I draw.  Having got the exterior shape, I then drag the walls and now closely watch the dimensions until it reaches the exterior dimensions I want.  You can use the keyboard arrow keys to nudge the wall just 1mm at a time if you want (Set the Nudge distance at Settings/ Programme Settings / Drawing Aids - defaults to 25mm).  I then insert the interior walls and again drag them to make the room size what I want.  No need to key in any measurement, anwhere, and very quick!.

I know you can type dimensions in but I have never found a need to do so and it is so slow and frustrating.

Doing it this way, for hundreds of plans, has had an added bonus for me - I'm still sane!! (I think!).  

Give it a go.

Allan

[tg]

When I lengthen my inside walls, it changes the outside walls to match.

How can I keep the outside walls stable?

Thanks, tg

[Allan Chesney]

Hi tg,

I don't fully understand the problem.  How are you lengthening the walls?
Normally if you lengthen an interior wall by dragging the end, it will just go straight through the outside wall and keep going - it does not move it.

Maybe if you posted an image it would help to see what you are trying to do.

Allan

[swampypants]

Hello again Allan,

I too was having the same problem so I followed your advice. All very good, but when I drag the walls to make them longer or shorter, there are no dimensions showing, so I don't know how far to drag them.

How do I get the program to show dimensions when dragging the wall?

[Allan Chesney]

Are you draging a wall or lengthening it?  When you drag a wall (using the blue marker in the centre of it) you should automatically get the dimensions on the connecting walls and they will automatically stretch, as they remain attached to the other wall you are draging. 

If you are just lengthening a single free standing wall by stretching the end of it, you do not get the dimensions, but if you select the wall you want to lengthen, right click and select Lengthen, then click the end of the wall again, you will see the Commander bar at the bottom of the screen displays the length - stretch and watch the dimension and stop when you get the length you want (or you can type it in).  Personally I find this difficult to use. Another easy way is to put a temporary wall at right angles to where you want your wall to finish, lengthen the wall to it and then delete the unwanted wall.

Allan

[swampypants]

When I drag the wall (to change length) using the blue centre marker I get no dimensions It's really fiddly to get the correct length.I have changed the nudge distance to 5 mm but it still gives me increments down to 1 mm. Trying to get the correct length is like trying to push a cloud up a hill with a sharp stick.

I tried the second method but when I type in the length I want the wall, It lengthens the wall by that amount. I have even tried using a calculator to work out how much I should lengthen the wall by but the wall length comes out different on the program. No use to me.

I cannot see what is easy to do about the third method.

Whenever I type in a wall length in the Commander (nice and easy and logical) it automatically adjusts the length of the opposite wall. This would be great if you are designing a square house but my house is over 300 years old and the walls are not square with each other. This completelyscrews everything up.

I really appreciate your time and effort helping me and hope you can forgive me if I am being thick.

Many thanks,

Swampy

[Allan Chesney]

Hi Swampy,

There is something wrong here - the dimensions should appear automatically - there is no way to turn them off.

Start a new project, draw 4 walls that form a rectangle and make sure they join at the end. In this process did you see any dimensions at all?  You should have seen dimensions on every wall as you drew them. Once completed, select the left hand end wall - you should see the internal width and external width displayed.  If you select the top wall you should see the internal and external depth displayed. If you select the blue marker in the centre of a wall and drag it, the internal and external dimensions should change as you drag the wall. Do you see any dimensions at all in any of these situations?

If you do not see any at all, try going to Settings / Programme Settings / Graphics and un-tick the box for Hardware Acceleration and see if that makes any difference.  If they now appear, then it would indicate that the driver on your computer's video card is not up to date. You can leave Hardware Acceleration off until you can identify and fix the driver issue but you may find moving around a bit slower.  There could be other PC issues here too ,so Pat or another 'technical' person (i'm not!) may ask you some other questions depending on your responce to this test.

Also please let us know what version you are using (See Help/ About... for the full version number). I noticed when I opened your model in the sloping roof query, that it is not the latest version (V15.0..C2.770).  Pat will also want to know about the type of video card you have, processor speed, RAM, operating system and other specifications.

Anyway for now, try it with Hardware Acceleration off and see what happens.

Allan

[murphj]

In reply to Paul the aussie and others
These are the same problems that I have experiwncedd, being a newbie.
It is graet to have Allan to help us and also another Aussie on the forum. We can all give a bit of cheek from down under.
I cant find anywhere in the manual that gives good practical advice on how to do some of the first steps required to produce a basic floor plan, without "pulling your hair out" in the process. I have spent countless hours trying different techniques to draw basic house plans, to dimensions and scale and have succeeded only by trial and error, prior to Allan's help on the forum. One of the best tecniques is the one Allan referred to which allows you to draw a plan by drgging the mouse and not having to enter individual measurements.Guys like Allan know these things through their experience and training, but newbies get stuck on the basics. I am currently documenting a set of "First Steps" procedures to help overcome the problems that newbies experience and will be sending it to Allan for editing, amending etc prior to posting it on the forum.The "first steps will not cover any advanced techniques, bu only such things as how to draw a basic house plan, with walls, windows,doors and hopefuuly a roof. Stay tuned !
In the meantime Paul the Aussie may find the attached settings useful in drawing up a plan in the manner that Allan described. I have found it quick and easy to drag the cursor, rather than enter the measurements. The Spacing  setting of 100 X 100  will allow the plan to be drawn to 100 mm roundings.You will probably find that the plans you are reproducing from are rounded off to 100 mm, 50 mm or even 10 MM increments. You can change the settings to suit. ie 50mm, 10 mm etc.
Make sure you have the Snap Grid(f4) ticked on and the circle set to match grid.
murphj (Brian the aussie)

[murphj]

I just posted a reply, (complete with spelling mistakes). I dont know wheter my attachment went through.
Can someone please tell me how to attach a word doc?

[Doug.S]

When you open a "reply",

look below the open window to enter text reply:  for "additional options", click on it and it has an "Attach:" browse button

it allows for .doc files up to 5MB

[murphj]

     Re: Setting / locking walls to a specific length
« Reply #8 on: Today at 11:50:39 AM » Quote Modify Remove 

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------


This is a copy of my previous post
Thanks to Dougs for showing me how to attach a file
I will try it again

In reply to Paul the aussie and others
These are the same problems that I have expericed, being a newbie.
It is graet to have Allan to help us and also another Aussie on the forum. We can all give a bit of cheek from down under.
I cant find anywhere in the manual that gives good practical advice on how to do some of the first steps required to produce a basic floor plan, without "pulling your hair out" in the process. I have spent countless hours trying different techniques to draw basic house plans, to dimensions and scale and have succeeded only by trial and error, prior to Allan's help on the forum. One of the best tecniques is the one Allan referred to which allows you to draw a plan by drgging the mouse and not having to enter individual measurements.Guys like Allan know these things through their experience and training, but newbies get stuck on the basics. I am currently documenting a set of "First Steps" procedures to help overcome the problems that newbies experience and will be sending it to Allan for editing, amending etc prior to posting it on the forum.The "first steps" will not cover any advanced techniques, but only such things as how to draw a basic house plan, with walls, windows,doors and hopefuuly a roof. Stay tuned !
In the meantime Paul the Aussie may find the attached settings useful in drawing up a plan in the manner that Allan described. I have found it quick and easy to drag the cursor, rather than enter the measurements. The Spacing  setting of 100 X 100  will allow the plan to be drawn to 100 mm roundings.You will probably find that the plans you are reproducing from are rounded off to 100 mm, 50 mm or even 10 MM increments. You can change the settings to suit. ie 50mm, 10 mm etc.
Make sure you have the Snap Grid(f4) ticked on and the circle set to match grid.
see attchment
murphj (Brian the aussie)

[swampypants]

Hi Guys,

Allan:

I am using: Pro Version 14.0.C1.673, build date March 25th 2009.

I don't have a problem with my computer as you suggest, I am getting the same results as you I just didn't explain myself very well.

When I try and use on screen dimensions it is too fiddly to do accurately, it takes ages just to draw one wall. I have the same problem with drawing a temporary wall. If I could nudge the distance by using my arrow keys as has been suggested It would help, but when I press my arrow keys nothing happens. To summarise: dragging the walls is ridiculously fiddly.

I have selected nudge distance to 5mm nut this doesnt make it nudge in 5mm increments. I need 5 mm increments because It is an extension to an existing very old house built on different levels. None of the measurements are uniform so I have rounded them to the nearest 5mm. Maybe I am being too fussy.

When I type in a measurement for a wall (very easy, I find), It adjusts the opposite wall without me asking it to. The opposite wall is now the wrong length. So I adjust it. Now the program adjusts the last wall that I just did as well, without me asking it to. So I am stuck in a vicious circle. I put in the length I want and it does it but by changing the length of another wall that was already at the correct length and now is at the wrong length. And so it goes on.

I get the same unrequested auto adjustment problem by dragging the walls. The walls are not meant to be uniform lengths, it's a 300+ year old cottage. Nothing is square in my house.

So bearing in mind the above points and the advice given so far, my real problems broken down are:
1) How do I draw a quick and accurate wall?
2) when I have done this, how do I stop the programme altering other walls.

Murfj:
I am pleased it's not just me pulling my hair out!

Thanks again guys.

[Allan Chesney]

Hi again,

It is a shame I cannot see what you are actually doing - drawing a wall (or all 'four' for that matter) should only take a split second and dragging them to the required dimension another second. I suspect the problem here is that your walls are not at right angles and I am guessing that you are trying to type in a length and expecting it to alter the angle of the connecting walls. (Interesting that I have used the program for so many years and never had to type in a wall dimension - other than testing of course).

IF walls are supposed to be right angles, them make sure that ORTHO is turned on (Status bar - lower right of screen). This will ensure that they ARE right angles. Then, when you drag the blue marker on the wall (or Nudge it with the arrow keys) both or any connecting walls will extend as they should and you will see the measurement change in 5mm increments (if that is what Nudge is set to).

If the walls are not at right angles (as yours obviously aren't) then you must have the correct degree of the angle, so the wall that connectes the other two joins to the corners.  You cannot extend one wall and expect the angle of the connectiong wall to change its angle - it will always stay at the angle it is drawn, so it must be drawn at the correct angle in the first place.  You can set the default angle in Settings / Programme Settings / Drawing Aids and use the Status AngleSnap to make it snap to the correct angle as you draw it (or you can type the angle into the Commander Bar - but that gets confusing to me). Now you can use the blue centre point of the angled wall to drag (or nudge) to the dimension you want and both walls will extend, the angled wall keeping its angle.  By the way, Nudge only works to move objects or walls (by selecting the Blue marker) - it does not work to Lengthen things.

Does this seem as though it addresses the problem or am I still missing the point?

As you would have noticed above, Brian has started to put together some simple instructions and he has sent them to me to check first, to see if we can make this easier for people.  The walls are probably the simplest things to do in the program and I can't understand why so many seem to have problems with them - really they are just 4 clicks to make a rectangular (or even angled) building.

So to your specific questions:

1) How do I draw a quick and accurate wall?
2) when I have done this, how do I stop the programme altering other walls.

1) Click where you want the wall to start, move the mouse at the angle you want it to be to lengthen the wall and click when you reach the length the wall should be. Continue moving the mouse (at right angles to the original wall -or whatever the angle it should be) and click again when you reach the length of that wall. Do the same again and again (if there are 4 walls) and make sure the final join meets where you started and snaps together.  If you want you can now turn on Auto Exterior Dimensions (Tools / Dimensions) and if the dimensions are not exactly correct, drag the blue marker of any wall (or Nudge) to make the length of the walls exact.

2) You cannot fix walls in one position (except ALL of them on one Location). Exterior walls should move with other walls if you drag one - otherwise they would break and floor and roof could collapse. If you want to drag an Interior wall just for one room and it is part of a continuous wall, you must break the wall (right click) in two places and drage then ends in from the break. You can now move the part of the wall between the breaks, then stretch it out to meet another wall, or lengthen the other walls to join up to the new position.

OR (even easier maybe)...
You could select the part of the wall you want to move, right click Duplicate, click the wall you want to duplicate then type in the Commander bar the distance you want to move it (eg 1000mm) and the angle (180 degrees) and the wall will position exactly where you want it. Then delete the old one and extend the other two walls to connect to the new postion.

Hope that makes sense - needs an image so I may add that shortly.

Allan