As excellent forum helper Allan already said: Google (now: Trimble) Sketchup Warehouse is an excellent source of finding 3D objects that can be imported in TFP.
But he also gave a warning: many of them are corrupt and make TFP crash.
Indeed, as I experienced now. Roughly 50% cannot be imported and it is a lottery which ones work and which ones not.
Why is that?
Are so many developers of .skp object pure amateurs? Even reputed companies have .skp files there that will not work.
Is the size of such file an indication for success? Can TFP only handle a certain limited size?
Is there a way to 'repair' .skp files that do not seem to work?
There are many SketchUp models that are fine. I rarely ever use them but that is largely because I enjoy making my own objects within TFP. My warning about them is only based on the number who have had corruption problems in a model and it has turned out to be an imported object - not just SketchUp ones but 3DS too.
Yes the SKP obkects are largely made by amatuers. I have seen many with stray bits and pieces 'floating' around the object itself and these can be a real isse when TFP tries to render the image. This is a reason why I am cautious of them.
Size in not necessarily an indication of anything really. If the model is complex, with curved surfaces, then the polygon count will be high and eat up your computer's resources but a good, complex, large object may be fine, while a small, simple one, could be badly made and cause problems.
I am not aware of any limit to the size of object TFP can handle - I know some very big ones have been used sucessfully.
The number of failures you have had may be because you are importing SKP models that were made in the latest SKP version (V8 I think) that was released AFTER TFP 16. TFP would not understand these. You need to download SKP objects in V7 or earlier format. TFP should accept them. The next version of TFP should handle SKP V8 objects.
The only way to repair the object may be to open it in SketchUp (or other3D program), remove any stray 'floaties' and save again in V7 or earlier but there is no way of knowing exactly what it is that TFP has a problem with. The problem does not usually show until you do a photographic render, so it is probably these tiny tragments that it has difficulty with. I am no expert in this area by any means, but just from the experiences of other users over many years and a few of my own, I have come to the conclusion that this is what causes the problem. Some others may have over ideas on this.
Allan
Hi WimYogya,
Usually the skp files published in the 3D warehouse website are not corrupted, and they work fine when you open these files with Sketchup.
However, objects developed with a third party program (skp, 3DS, etc) may cause a program to crash, but not because the objects are corrupted. The main reason for the crash is a computer with low rendering resources. Of course, first and as Allan stated, you must check if TFP is able to import the objects' version
But over all, keep in mind that, with complex obejcts, we are talking about a computer crashing, not a program crashing
The problems with Graphic cards + 3D programs + 3D objects are complex.
1 - Most of the video cards are designed for gaming, therefore, for the average card, speed comes first and precision after. In other words, if during a computer game you are "chasing a monster" certainly, you are not interested in the exact shadows of the castle's walls, or the textures' effects--> your only interest is speed. However, if you are a 3D designer, you need accuracy, even if the rendering takes more time. This is the reason why, with several video cards, to get good rendering results and accuracy you need to reduce the speed (accelerations) . Now, the ATI Radeon cards using the Catalyst driver work fine with full accelerations. I have 2 computers one with Nvidia and the other with ATI and the difference is impressive
2 - Onboard video cards/chips are almost useless for rendering purposes. There is a good reason for this: onboard video cards share the processor, therefore (as explained above) the same processor is used for calculations and rendering. With complex surfaces, this process is almost impossible. In other words, if you have just walls, roofs, etc, the system will work, but if you have furniture, columns , molding , etc, (lots of polygons) the system will crash
Pat
Good tip: with SketchUp 7 more elements can be added. Thanks.
@ Pat: Thanks for the extra clarification.
I assume my graphic card can be part of the problem.
Recently I had a new pc assembled and I told my 'composer' that I am not a gamer, so I didn't need the maximum graphic performance.
As I see on my dxdiag display I have an Intel(R) HD Graphics Card, I assume it is onboard. Correct?
At the moment I cannot afford to spend money on a separate card just to solve my .skp problems, but if I want, in the future, what u recommend me to do?
Thanks!
Pat, I was very interested in your comments on the subject of video cards as I am contemplating the purchase of a new computer. In your opinion, what would be the best video card to drive TFP. I realise that TFP publishes a basic specification but obviously you have a good handle on graphic specifications. I am not interested in gaming.
Quote from: WimYogya on August 05, 2012, 01:26:28 AM
@ Pat: Thanks for the extra clarification.
I assume my graphic card can be part of the problem.
Recently I had a new pc assembled and I told my 'composer' that I am not a gamer, so I didn't need the maximum graphic performance.
As I see on my dxdiag display I have an Intel(R) HD Graphics Card, I assume it is onboard. Correct?
At the moment I cannot afford to spend money on a separate card just to solve my .skp problems, but if I want, in the future, what u recommend me to do?
Thanks!
Hi there,
You're welcome ;)
If you have an onboard video card (meaning that your video card is part of your motherboard) you can't disable the video card and add a separated video card, because the process is not going to work. And in the long run, you will damage your computer.
Motherboards with onboard vc are programmed to work first with the onboard vc and, if it is not present (or it is disabled ), you'll (probably) get a crash. Keep in mind that, even if you disable the OBVC, you are not changing the program of the processor (motherboard)
And even if the processor looks for the new vc, it will take a long time looking for a new vc, however, it will use the main memory (and not your new vc's memory) . Keep in mind that this process (and time) will happen each time you use the vc, because you are not programming the processor
In other words, if you have an onboard video card, you cannot upgrade your system
Pat
Quote from: Burgo on August 05, 2012, 05:00:52 PM
Pat, I was very interested in your comments on the subject of video cards as I am contemplating the purchase of a new computer. In your opinion, what would be the best video card to drive TFP. I realise that TFP publishes a basic specification but obviously you have a good handle on graphic specifications. I am not interested in gaming.
Hi there,
The rendering process has two stages--> In the first stage, your computer prepares the image (cataloguing surfaces, textures, compiling the data, etc), in other words in this first stage, the processor + the RAM memory are in charge, making calculations. The second part is the rendering stage--> with the info developed and collected from the first image, the image is drawn in the screen, using CPU / vc, video CPU cycles and video card memory
The basic rendering is "muscle based" so it uses more raster resources, therefore your videocard must work in full force
The advanced rendering is more "inteligence based" so it uses more vector resources, therefore if you have a set (motherboard, chip, motherboard, memory), you will render without problems
For the above reasons, I don't recommend to focus only on the Video Card: the key is a computer ready for serious rendering. This means a good processor / chip + RAM memory + video card
These specs are based on my personal experience, and of course, other specs may work or not.
I'd choose a processor with (at least) 2.8 GHz (3.0 or up if you can), RAM at least 4 GB (8 GB if you can), and video card with dedicated memory with at least 512 Mb (1 GB to 2 GB if you can)
Some additional tips
- choose a computer / video card with a good cooling system. This is not a small detail: one a my computers has a video card with double deck cooling system and this helps a lot with heavy rendering. Example: my old Dell computer came with a great processor, a great video card but a very small fan. For this reason, after a couple of hours doing rendering, the system becomes very slow
- Keep in mind that, in order to handle a memory with more than 4 MB, you will need a Windows operative system with 64 bits. TFP is a 32 bit program but it works just fine with 64 bits, but other programs may have problems. Example: I have a couple of Corel programs that are useless in my new computer
Hope this helps!
Pat
Pat, thank you very much for your informative reply, much appreciated.
Same thanks from me, Pat. Seems I have to live with limitations existing life and existing pc's bring. I will survive!
You're welcome! :D
Pat
My thanks too Pat.
It is nice to have a clear explanation of what is involved from the computer's perspective and the rendering implications.
It will be interesting to see how this will be affected (if it is), if the next version inherits the rendering changes from the latest version of Envisioneer (which it usually does). Basic rendering is not there anymore, although the raytrace function still follows radiosity. Seems for outside you render with quality set very low and then raytrace completes it. Render speed has been dramatically increased - by 5 times apparently!
Allan
This is still far beyond my understanding...
Quote from: Allan Chesney on August 06, 2012, 09:22:04 AM
My thanks too Pat.
It is nice to have a clear explanation of what is involved from the computer's perspective and the rendering implications.
It will be interesting to see how this will be affected (if it is), if the next version inherits the rendering changes from the latest version of Envisioneer (which it usually does). Basic rendering is not there anymore, although the raytrace function still follows radiosity. Seems for outside you render with quality set very low and then raytrace completes it. Render speed has been dramatically increased - by 5 times apparently!
Allan
You're welcome! :D
We'll see this by the time of the new release.... of course, if the price is OK for the upgrade ::)
Pat
Pat, further to your in depth explanation of computer specification to best suit TFP rendering, you might like to comment on the the specifications I am considering for a new computer.
1 CPU INT I5 2500 Intel i5-2500 CPU 3.3GHz
1 CAS ATX ATX TOWER CASE WITH USB
1 MB GA B75M Gigabyte B75M-D3V Motherboard
1 RAM 1333 8G 8G (2x4G) DDR3 1333 RAM
1 HD WD 2T 2TB WD SATA3 HDD
1 DVD SA 22X SAMSUNG 22X DVD RW DL BURNER
1 V GT620 1 G nVidia GT620 PCI-e
1 FAN TT 120mm Case Fan
1 SW OS 7 HOME Windows 7 Home Premium 64bit
Many thanks, Bob
Hi Bob,
I'll be glad to comment, but I'd need an additional information
Re: the videocard --> is it Nvidia or PNY Nvidia? (is not the same)
Pat
Thanks Pat, I believe it is Nvidia, the website is http://www.myshopping.com.au/PR--425683_Inno3D_GT_620_2GB_Graphics_Card
I'd suggest an i7 cpu instead of i5 if you can afford extra $100
see performance gain/difference, very useful for render time reductions and multiple/concurrent apps
http://www.cpubenchmark.net/common_cpus.html
Quote from: Burgo on August 09, 2012, 07:47:54 PM
Thanks Pat, I believe it is Nvidia, the website is http://www.myshopping.com.au/PR--425683_Inno3D_GT_620_2GB_Graphics_Card
Hi Bob
These are cards developed by a 3rd party (Inno 3D in this case). NVidia only provides the chip. I'd suggest to buy directly from the manufacturer
Pat
Thankyou Pat & Doug for your comments. Intel Core i7
[email protected] is worth considering.