Additional Catalogs

[Doug.S]

Carrara is comprehensive and like any 3D program you will learn bits and pieces as you go and get more comfortable using it.

As a first guide: there are "rooms" or different views for different functionality: assemble (mostly for viewing and arranging), texture room, render room, and modeling room....to keep one view from too much clutter but requires moving back and forth...that seems new to most people.

Normally I'd suggest starting with a new file either empty and add simple objects to get a feel for the windows and palettes or open a preset scene and poke/look around to get a feel of the UI.

To answer your questions (and OK to ask a few more questions here but you will get lots of fast help from the DAZ3D forum or Yahoo Carrarafan forum).

Yes...scaling is the issue/problem...and it depends on the scale of the file/new/empty scene before you import the .3ds from TFP....once you import .3ds, and have it selected...go to the properties palette (right side of screen in assemble room), "motion" tab at top (next to general tab) to get to the scale and rotation...check keep proportions "uniform" and change "overall"  to a different number..probably larger...Carrara has many "un-do's" (preferences set to max. is best) ...adjust until the .3ds looks like a size that fills the 3 axis grid. Since you are probably going from metric to inches it may be different so I have no recommendation.  (you can set Carrara to work in metric in file/prefs).

You might see that the animation palette at bottom also has the same list of instances....so you can adjust things over time for animations.

In the bottom part of properties palette in "instances" tab is the one .3ds item listed as you noticed....there is a triangle twisty next to the name to expand the list of all items in the 3ds object (house) as a group...click the triangle at left of name to open/close the long sub-group list. When open you can select any single item, when closed you can only select the group.  Also note that the 3D view camera rotate, and how the screen rotates, depends on what, and if, anything is selected. Seems odd at first but as you use it, it becomes an advantage to moving around in 3D.

On your render question...you go to the render room and use the 3 tabs at top for setup, output, and progress.  Its probably set to render animation if you visited the storyboard" room (which hardly anyone uses)....just change rendering "output" tab to render "current frame" (probably at time=0) to get a bmp or jpg file also selected in "output" tab file format.

In assemble room:   see menu/view/show production frame to see an outline of what will be rendered as seen by the camera. If you select the camera icon (keyboard shortcut "x") you can drag a rectangular window anywhere (more than once) to render a part of the view quickly for a "look see" without a full view render...much faster.

Quick tour should work as well as a help file....but if it does not, look in the program files directory where you installed Carrara and look for .pdf help file....you can open that alone without Carrara open if you wish. pdf has a good search ability.

Hope this helps.....if you feel more comfortable exchanging emails outside of TFP forum you can write to me directly and I'll try to reply when I can.

[Allan Chesney]

Thanks Doug - seems to make some sense from memory.  I haven't time to open it at the moment to try it out but I have printed your notes so I can have it in front of me when I do. I think I can get the hang of it once I can actually see what I am supposed to be rendering!!!  Yes I had clicked on Storyboard which apparently is what got me into the animation side of things.

I did an animation in TFP the other and it came out beautifully - the people were thrilled to bits with concept and the movie itself and so was I.  It came out better and quicker than I expected. 250MB but the quality was excellent and enabled them to decide immediately.

It will be interesting to see how Carrara compares - when/if I get that advanced.

I'll try not to bother you too much on it.

Thanks again

Allan

[Doug.S]

Carrara has much more control over animation and outputs....paths and otherwise with adjustable tweeners for full control of cameras and objects and lights and even material texture shaders...actually everything is adjustable vs. time; including a graphical UI for adjusting if desired. So for example you could make an object change textures and fade n or out vs. time. A few users generate work for TV stations and commercials as well as print and web.

Also has codecs built-in (many) to save either full or compressed files and control output quality...for output to PC or MAC or both

Another animation ability is rotoscoping.....show a movie in the scene as the program is generating an output animation.  Example is showing a video stream on a 3D object in a scene such as a TV set while you render a camera walkthru motion. You can also add any audio files for sound effects.

Also for 3D still renders also check out non-realistic renders to look like a hand sketch or artistic painting as well as wireframe renders.

[Allan Chesney]

Sounds good but unfortunately I suspect a big learning curve. Maybe I should retire so I can enjoy myself!

Allan

[alindsay55661]

I attempted to get the extra catalogs from Broderbund.com where I purchased the download.  They told me everything was in the 173MB download but that can't be the case as the catalog seems to be small and other users have posted here that there are 233MB worth of additional catalog.  After directing them to this forum and explaining that there were additional downloads they said I had to purchase a backup DVD at an additional cost.  Is there a way I can get the full product?  I did pay for it but Broderbund seems unwilling to contact IMSI about the additional downloads.

Any help is greatly appreciated.  I am simply looking to get the entire product.  I can provide proof of purchase if needed.

[Allan Chesney]

Hi Alan,

I don't know that I can help much with this one but maybe I can make it not feel so bad. 

First you may have noted an earlier post from Dave Taylor (IMSI Design rep) in this thread.

You should get the extra content from the vendor that you purchased from.
I cannot post those links here for obvious reasons:) but can assure they are available for download, just not part of the program.exe download.

That seems to imply that Broderbund should be able to provide the download version of the extra catalogs.  If they won't/cannot do so then you may be able to take it up with IMSI Design direct. They do not actively monitor this forum so may not see your post. You could also try CadCourse.com who are usually very cooperative.

Having said that I would not be too worried if it all gets too difficult. I did download them, as provided by IMSI Design from whom I purchased V12 in the first place, but to be honest I only found two elements that I thought I may use (but haven't yet!). I have opened each catalog once, looked at each element, installed 2 and transferred them to my master catalog and never looked at any of the catalogs again since.  I got the impression that all the good ones had been included in the standard catalog and these were the ones that missed out.   The bathroom items for example were groups of items. Fine in themselves but if the bathroom items were not in the precise positions you wanted each item too bad.  That is where they are and stay, so useless really for a personal design.  Your needs may be different to mine of course and there MAY be things you could use and I can understand that you would want to have a look to satisfy yourself, but as I indicated before, If you can't get your hands on them, you are probably not missing much.

If you are looking for some specific items just ask in this forum, or do a google search for 3DS objects and you can usually get what you need.

Allan

[alindsay55661]

Allan, thanks for the info, this does make me feel better.  Broderbund claims to have no knowledge of any other download and initially said everything was included in the 173MB program exe.  After a few emails they finally said I could purchase a backup DVD, very poor service.  That is why I posted here, my original vendor is clueless about the other catalog downloads.

On to the net I guess...

[UKLN5245]

 

[Kajvin - Robert W]

In the latest version of TFP H&L Pro 14.0.C2.662 can you use multiple catalog then you render. But use the standard-catalog then you rendering. Then you raytrace will the rendering flicker but that normal the rendering switch between the catalogs. In the preview window will the all items from the other catalogs disappear that is also normal.  

In the image below have I use standard catalog + on catalog with plumbing items only from Kohlers bathroom-items, I self have done to TFP H&L PRO v12 and convert to TFP H&L pro 14, this catalog is on nearly 10 Mb, to the bookshelf have I use a imported dxf-fil what i converted in Acme CADSee from a dwg 3d file from KI Office.
The frame around one of the bathtub have I make with standard Wood Retaining Wall
I think that the latest version work very well I can even do other tings when the program rendering that I couldn't with the older version, they have made good job with the update. Bravo!!

[Allan Chesney]

Hi Robert,

I agree with you that the latest version / update seems to work well.  Some of the old rendering issues are still there of course, notably the way interior walls become black in DIRECT sunlight (not through windows or doors) and trying to get a balance between sunlight and artificial light (sunlight through windows can turn interior lights off), but rendering does seem to be quicker and not take so many PC resources.

At the same time I have a new PC so I am not quite sure what to attribute to that also.  It is definitely better though.

Your 'plumbing' render has come out very nicely!.

Allan

[Kajvin - Robert W]

Hi Allan!

I wonder how many diffrent catalogs you can use in on drawing and rendering it befor the program crash I think I will test it i have 2o diffrent, in range from 11kb to 41Mb.

Robert

[Allan Chesney]

Hi Robert,
Good question!

I rarely use other catalogues myself.  Occasionally I find something useful but usually just add it into my main catalogue.  I tend to make most things I do not have using existing elements and functions.   You have no doubt seen the threads in the links in this post http://forums.turbofloorplan.com/index.php/topic,805.msg3839.html#msg3839 but will include it in case others haven't.

It never ceases to amaze me what you can create within TFP.

Let us know how you get on with you multi catalogue test.

Allan

[Kajvin - Robert W]

I have now done a multiple catalog test, this is a difficult to render because I have glass walls.
I is very happy with the out-coming of the test.

Render settings                                 Render results                                  Total size of catalog is 133 817 kB
Radiosity                                         Radiosity                                         i have use 7 different catalogs size on the drawing-zip
step 500                                         278/500
update 20                                      time 215s
Daylight unchecked
Raytrazing antialiasing 4                     Raytrazing results
output 1024x768                               768/768 line
                                                      time 840s

[Allan Chesney]

Hi Robert,

Than has come out quite well.  When I first tried to open your BLD file it complained that it 'could not open the template' but it worked on the second try.  I tried rendereing it myself using Quality 5 and to see if it would complete all 1500/1500 steps in the radiosity and it did.  I have noticed in the past that if set to 1500 steps it does always seem to go the full number. Interesting the Radiosity phase took twice as long as yours, which is understandable since there were so many more steps, but the raytrace was only half the time.  That could be PC differences maybe.

I was curious whether the extra radiosity time may have eliminated the dark patches in the ceiling, but then I noticed that it is actually the underside of the roof rather than a ceiling.  I have found in the past that the roof underside often seems to render in a patchy way for some reason and I have been experimenting with this in the past to try to find a reason.  I have not found any reason previously but using your model I may have found the cause!  Anyway I added  a ceiling to your model to test it out and the patches went, so it was not a lighting condition, although I did not put the skylights through.  They should not make any difference anyway as sunlight was turned off. The ceiling rendered a lot darker overall however so I had to boost the overall lighting (+1) to achieve the render below.  

In trying to match my camera view to yours however, I noticed that the dark area on the ceiling in the 'games room' reappeared when the CAMERA was ABOVE the normal ceiling or wall height. In my first render I had the camera just below wall height and it seems this is why the patches dissappeared not because of the extra radiosity quality setting. In other words, if we do a render with the camera inside what would normally be a roof cavity, the patchy effect appears (at least sometimes). I have noticed different effects previously when rendering an inside view with the camera above ceiling height - even if there is NO ceiling. See the images in this post: http://forums.turbofloorplan.com/index.php/topic,997.0.html.

Both images below were done on quality 3 with brightness at +1 and they completed all 500 steps in 166 sec for Radiosity and Raytrace took 526 seconds.  The FIRST was done with the camera ABOVE the height of the top of the wall (note dark area in 'games' room ceiling), while the SECOND had the camera just BELOW the top of the wall (the dark shadow has gone). All the settings, except the camera height, were identical.

You will notice too that in the second image the whole ceiling is lighter and a 'warmer ' colour as the light and colour is reflected off the floor as should happen with radiosity. It appears there is an invisible 'ceiling' at the top of wall height that shields this radient light, making the ceiling darker, uneven and without the colour reflection that should be there.

The obvious inferrence in this is that if we are doing inside renders in a model with a cathedral ceiling (or no ceiling), that the camera should be positioned below the height of the walls as specified in Building Locations.

It would be interesting if you rendered yours again but move the camera slightly lower so that it is below the wall height and see if the dark patch goes and radient light appears. If you get the same result as me, then it looks like we have something for the programmers to look at for V15.

Allan

[Kajvin - Robert W]

 Hi Allan you have done a great work, as a test of multiply catalogs I think you can agree with me it's a success. That you culdent open the BLD the first time, maybe it was because it was different catalogs involved. It seems that the program have incloud all the diffrent catalogs very well in the BLD-file.

I will make a new rendering in this weckend and see if I got same result as you.

Robert