wrong mirror reflections

[Allan Chesney]

Hi Doug,

I did have a look at the walls etc in your model and everything looked very clean - couldn't see any problems other than the floor that you knew about anyway.

There have not been any updates released on V15 as yet. When I opened your file it prompted me to convert it. I am using Build 824 but this has not been released yet - in beta testing at present.

Like you I rarely use Basic render - only for totally exterior views sometimes.

Allan

[Doug.S]

Wow, thought I fixed this issue but now another new one; slight twist.

Same file but re-arranged furniture, made half of long wall darker paint...rendered OK, see first image attached.

Then added some "text" on the wall.....used duplicate of picture next to it, applied .bmp picture of text on magenta background, used magenta for rest of member frame...expecting only text to render....showed well on screen, render is text only OK,

BUT, as you can see it went very dark (did not change lighting)  see attached....and if I try to brighten/lighten image in pixel program, it shows that the ceiling is actually reflecting all sorts of stuff.....much like the dark sliding door mirrors earlier in this thread.

Before I made the back of the text picture magenta, it rendered OK but the member was all wood. "Text" does render OK.

I'll keep playing with it...maybe try 100% transparency of the applied color.  But wondering if I found another "bug"?

Render (radiosity) set for 1500 but quit when reached 19 (in just a couple seconds)...raytrace finished OK.

[Doug.S]

Success.....

first tried changing from "texture" (imported .bmp 64x64 pure magenta color) applied to member....and results were very dark per previous post above,

Changed to "color" from within TFP (color as pure magenta)....but render (see attached) was not transparent (nor magenta)

So then made that color 100% transparent using the controls (all rest set = 0),  and render is OK...see text (Music) on the wall per attached below.

Just gotta work the tools a bit......so it is another lesson learned.

[Allan Chesney]

Hi Doug,

I have come accross this before and found that using a photoboard worked fine for lettering etc and rendered properly, while using magenta directly on a object (not a photoboard) had odd effects on rendering, causing it to end premeturely and hence dark.  Using 100% transparency worked well, with correct render times and exposure as you found.

Allan

[Doug.S]

OK, I tried using a photoboard and the results were excellent....it seems like the best solution.....thanks for the tip. I considered it early on but thought I remembered render problems from before....but using my own image on a photoboard is easy and works.

I turned in a new feature suggestion.....that TFP should be able to use .png files for situations like this....and not have to deal with magenta for transparency.

.png is a www standard file format these days and easy to get or create.

[Doug.S]

Yikes, the photoboard (and magenta transparent member) does not quite render correctly....looks like a light-thru-transparency bug.

(The text is supposed to look like a thin vinyl applique or like the lettering was painted on the wall.)

Yes the text renders with transparent background....but the wall behind the transparency is darker than it should be and the photoboard throws shadows all around itself.  See attached .jpg

At first I thought it was just the spacing of ceiling lights (1500 render to get best quality)....so moved them, then added a light, then added another light close to the wall....but render still dark in photoboard "music" text area on wall.  Unlike other walls that are dark only where lights are far away.  I have so many lights now the floor is washing out below that area. Look at ceiling to see the placement of ceiling lights.

So then duplicated the photoboard and put it on the other wall where lighting on wall was OK (see previous renders above)...voila! again the wall in and around the photoboard "music" was too dark.

I conclude it is a render bug.
I also included the .bld file in case someone else wants to play with it and see if they get different results or can find an error on my part.

BTW I also adjusted how close the photoboard was to the wall and the material properties such as color bleed, but they made no difference.

So maybe I can work around it by shining a spot light at the photoboard....will try that or fix in Photoshop post render.

PS tried to attach "music" .bmp but forum won't accept a .bmp. But oddly/ironically it will accept a .png

[Allan Chesney]

Hi Doug,

I would like to try rendering your model to see if I get the same results but obviously need the BMP.  I have adjusted the forum so you should now be able to attach it.  BMP is a much large file size, so this is probably why it has been excluded previously. I will monitor it for a while to see if it gets overused and causes problems.

Allan

[Doug.S]

Hi Doug,

I would like to try rendering your model to see if I get the same results but obviously need the BMP.  I have adjusted the forum so you should now be able to attach it.  BMP is a much large file size, so this is probably why it has been excluded previously. I will monitor it for a while to see if it gets overused and causes problems.

Allan

OK, attached, did a .zip @ 128K (did not see .zip was OK before) as original .bmp is 12MB  (wondering now if TFP has trouble with large .bmp files???)

also made a .jpg image so you know what the .bmp should look like

[Allan Chesney]

Hi Doug,

I tried a number of renders, without the photoboard and with it and there does appear to be a slight shadow.

With the photoboard imported I noticed some slowness in the model, and in view of the very large BMP size, I tried it again with the file size much smaller (under 500K). While there was now no speed problem it did not change the render. That would indicate that the render is not affected by a large file attached.

I must admit I found it incredible that zipping a BMP could reduce it to 12MB file to just 128K !

Allan

[Doug.S]

.zip was so small because file really only has 2 colors and not distributed....so there are long strings of the same...easily defined...hence a small file

Is there a way to post this to the developers to try to fix it?  In other words do I need to make another forum message in a better location?

[Allan Chesney]

Hi Doug,

You could do a post in the Feature Requests section, as they do look there when during development but I will send it through direct anyway and via Envisioneer, as any problems get fixed in Envisioneer first. TFP will inherit the fix in a future release of course. 

Allan

[Doug.S]

Thanks